B5 Rewatch: "Soul Mates"

[icepixie]

First, a macro I made for rivendellrose:

Now, the episode: Soul Mates
I'm terribly fond of this episode, mostly because of Timov. She's just so cool. And as Londo notes, he'll always know where he stands with her--too bad she didn't stick around, or maybe she might've been able to intervene in his downfall.

I'm also fond of the episode because it steals so shamelessly from King Lear. (Though I'm glad we didn't get a naked Londo ranting in a field during a thunderstorm.) Luckily for Londo, he is not taken in by the Reagan and Goneril figures' false affection, and it all ends rather more happily for him than it did for Lear.

I don't have much to say about the Talia/Stoner plot. It's interesting that Talia plots commonly (read: "for the last two episodes") involve audience fakeouts of some sort. And I do wonder what would be left of her if she could magically rid herself of her telepathy. So much of her identity is wrapped up in being a telepath, even if she's re-evaluating her relationship with Psi Corps. Would it be like losing a sense? Would the ability to fit in with normals and hide from Psi Corps be worth it? Also, logic question: why was she so shocked by the PC breeding program in the last episode if she was part of it? (I guess she was more horrified at the forced conception and the baby being taken away. Which makes sense.)

The Susan/Delenn stuff is maybe not the greatest way of passing the Bechdel test, but I love it anyway. (I love anything Susan/Delenn, really.) Of course Delenn would go to Ivanova for help--not only does Ivanova have great hair (I covet her hair, although I could never deal with long hair again), but she's someone Delenn knows well enough to trust with the secret that she's not really so confident about this change she's made. I still want to write the missing scene between them where Susan teaches her about human hygiene. One day, one day.

I wonder if the Minbari belief that souls travel in packs has any bearing on what happens in "Deconstruction of Falling Stars." Would any of them have been reincarnations of our characters? (Aside from Sheridan, who...apparently gets to hang out in limbo beyond the rim?) Or is it just the Minbari who get reincarnated?

Susan seemed to be having an especially good time at Londo's party. I get the impression she either really enjoys parties in general, or there's something about Centauri celebrations she likes. (Lots of booze?)

Comments

[mylittleredgirl.livejournal.com]

OH GOD THIS EPISODE. YOU COULD SUM UP MY FEELINGS WITH NOTHING BUT EXCLAMATION POINTS AND THE LETTER E.

The question is: would I love Talia and Garibaldi so much if Their Love hadn't been explained with Peter David wittiness? PROBABLY, BECAUSE IT ALSO INVOLVES TURBOLIFTS.

*eeeee!*

And Londo's wives are awesome. And Sheridan is ridiculous. I love Londo being all "No rly, for your own good, don't hook up with my wife" and Sheridan's like "uh...? are you going to punch me? I was just standing here probably thinking about oranges?" and Londo's like "Let's have a drink later." HILARIOUS. I also love the moment of Franklin just watching Timov give her big speech of operatic theatricality and he just goes with it. HA.

And Sheridan being like "Can I be BFF with you?" to Talia was so funny. HE IS A GOLDEN RETRIEVER. God love him. Can't decide if he just genuinely wants to be BFF (or, you know, my theory that Everyone Loves Talia At Least A Little), or if he's exercising his conspiracy love by plying her for Psi Corps breeding program secrets. It seems weird to me that neither he nor Garibaldi seemed overly surprised by the idea that the Psi Corps is breeding people against their will with the express purpose of creating MOAR STRONGER TELEPATHS. I mean, come on. Someone go to the news with this shiz!

[icepixie]

OH GOD THIS EPISODE. YOU COULD SUM UP MY FEELINGS WITH NOTHING BUT EXCLAMATION POINTS AND THE LETTER E.

Hehehehehe. Why am I not surprised?

The question is: would I love Talia and Garibaldi so much if Their Love hadn't been explained with Peter David wittiness? PROBABLY, BECAUSE IT ALSO INVOLVES TURBOLIFTS.

Turbolifts: best aphrodisiac ever invented! (I lol'ed so much at "Feel differently!")

I love Londo being all "No rly, for your own good, don't hook up with my wife" and Sheridan's like "uh...? are you going to punch me? I was just standing here probably thinking about oranges?" and Londo's like "Let's have a drink later." HILARIOUS.

Yeah, that was pretty awesome. (And hee, he probably WAS thinking about oranges!)

I also love the moment of Franklin just watching Timov give her big speech of operatic theatricality and he just goes with it. HA.

YES. Franklin is so great.

And Sheridan being like "Can I be BFF with you?" to Talia was so funny. HE IS A GOLDEN RETRIEVER.

God, yes, he so is.

God love him. Can't decide if he just genuinely wants to be BFF (or, you know, my theory that Everyone Loves Talia At Least A Little), or if he's exercising his conspiracy love by plying her for Psi Corps breeding program secrets.

Hmmm. Good question! Personally, I would not have categorized them as the "friends" he tries to call them at this point (or ever, really, but definitely not by this point). So maybe he was on a fishing expedition.

It seems weird to me that neither he nor Garibaldi seemed overly surprised by the idea that the Psi Corps is breeding people against their will with the express purpose of creating MOAR STRONGER TELEPATHS. I mean, come on. Someone go to the news with this shiz!

YES. I wonder if the arranged marriages are common knowledge, though. And Jason Ironheart already said that the military was the driving force behind the experiments done on him--the other side has stronger shields so we need stronger telepaths, etc. etc. So the breeding would be just another way of doing the same thing. And the general public doesn't really seem to give a damn about telepaths anyway, so why would they care if telepaths are being forced into arranged marriages?

[mylittleredgirl.livejournal.com]

Turbolifts: best aphrodisiac ever invented! (I lol'ed so much at "Feel differently!")

Item 1: YES. I can't believe I've only ever written one stuck-in-a-turbolift fanfic in my life. Since it's pretty much my favorite gimmick ever when they do it on any show.

Item 2: I love it whenever Talia bitches him out and he's like "bu-whu?" I'm pretty sure that if my OTP were to hook up, he would be buying her a lot of apology flowers since he's kind of a boor in some ways and she would cut him down. (I never write Talia as enough of a bitch! I need to work on this. Of course, my current Talia-centric fic is sort of a post-apocalyptic orgy, so she doesn't really have the time.) (This fic is going weirdly Talia/Sheridan places. Even though everyone is having sex with everyone. IDK.)

Personally, I would not have categorized them as the "friends" he tries to call them at this point (or ever, really, but definitely not by this point). So maybe he was on a fishing expedition.

Or, in his head, he's friends with everybody! Except people he actively hates. Or, who knows. Talia and Sinclair seemed to spend time together because she mediated stuff for him, and periodically he'd rope her into some scheme. We don't see Sheridan really mediating little trade agreements, but maybe he does in his free time.

And the general public doesn't really seem to give a damn about telepaths anyway, so why would they care if telepaths are being forced into arranged marriages?

Well... I guess I more figured the general public would care about Psi Corps trying to actively breed more and better telepaths, since people sort of would like them to just go away? I don't know. It seemed shocking to me on a note of "if people really knew how much Psi Corps pwned them, they would freaking riot."

[icepixie]

I'm pretty sure that if my OTP were to hook up, he would be buying her a lot of apology flowers since he's kind of a boor in some ways and she would cut him down.

I think you are probably right.

(Benefits to him hooking up with Ivanova: they'd fight, get into a wrestling match, and it would probably end with sex.)

I never write Talia as enough of a bitch! I need to work on this.

Hee. She is fun when she's cutting.

This fic is going weirdly Talia/Sheridan places. Even though everyone is having sex with everyone. IDK.

Talia/Sheridan is one pairing I hadn't considered. Hmmm.

Or, in his head, he's friends with everybody! Except people he actively hates.

Oh, Sheridan. They should bottle some of his outgoingness and sell it to people like me, who could use it to get out of our internet caves.

Talia and Sinclair seemed to spend time together because she mediated stuff for him, and periodically he'd rope her into some scheme. We don't see Sheridan really mediating little trade agreements, but maybe he does in his free time.

Hmmmm, true. I kind of feel like Sinclair did that kind of thing because he was...not a pushover, but because he was REALLY INTO making everyone get along, and willing to do boring mediation stuff to serve that purpose. (Also, because then he could work his own schemes.) Sheridan is more, "Whatever, work it out yourselves; I have ORANGES to buy!" Well, not always, but he's definitely less invested in galactic peace than Sinclair was, at least at this juncture.

Well... I guess I more figured the general public would care about Psi Corps trying to actively breed more and better telepaths, since people sort of would like them to just go away?

Maybe? I wonder if they've been appeased by the idea that Earth needs them for military purposes.

I don't know. It seemed shocking to me on a note of "if people really knew how much Psi Corps pwned them, they would freaking riot."

Hee. I think perhaps they do in some of the books? I hear there's a trilogy covering the Teep War.

[mylittleredgirl.livejournal.com]

(Benefits to him hooking up with Ivanova: they'd fight, get into a wrestling match, and it would probably end with sex.)

Your OTP really does hold serious logical advantages. My girl's high maintenance. I'm sure she drinks expensive wine on top of needing to be rescued from Psi Corps.

Talia/Sheridan is one pairing I hadn't considered. Hmmm.

I think... leyenn turned me on to it indirectly, because she wanted Susan/John/Talia, and then I started writing it (and the OT3 became OT4 because at that point really why not) and somehow John and Talia are on the same wavelength. (Plus, they're both FULL OF DESTINYYYYY.) On the upside, in my OT4, it would leave Susan and Michael together angstily fucking away their issues over having been in an OT4 for a while?

(Did I ever snippet you any of that fic? I can't decide if it's amazing or horrible. And the burgeoning feminist in me is wondering whether I've committed some irredeemable crime by making Talia's plan for averting the end of the universe to basically involve distracting everyone with sex, and she's sort of unclear about her reasons for doing so. I like my fic, but I worry I might be strung up by fandom. ;) (And, you know, Talia on the show is kind of a pawn always who gets violated a lot, so it's not entirely like I got this idea out of nowhere.)

kind of feel like Sinclair did that kind of thing because he was...not a pushover, but because he was REALLY INTO making everyone get along, and willing to do boring mediation stuff to serve that purpose.

Yes! You know, when you think about it, galactic wars aside, Sinclair probably served the station's original intention better. Although Sheridan had charisma to get people to unite, if a war didn't create itself for him, he might have made one out of boredom.

Maybe? I wonder if they've been appeased by the idea that Earth needs them for military purposes.

Perhaps. Or by the idea that they will only encounter them in certain situations. I wonder whether telepaths go hang out in coffee shops and stuff like normal humans on Earth, or if they tend to keep to themselves?

[icepixie]

Your OTP really does hold serious logical advantages. My girl's high maintenance. I'm sure she drinks expensive wine on top of needing to be rescued from Psi Corps.

Although if her scene in Susan's quarters is anything to go by, she provides her own wine.

I think... leyenn turned me on to it indirectly, because she wanted Susan/John/Talia, and then I started writing it (and the OT3 became OT4 because at that point really why not) and somehow John and Talia are on the same wavelength. (Plus, they're both FULL OF DESTINYYYYY.)

Mmmm, the magnetic attraction of the touched by Vorlons destined. That would be fun.

On the upside, in my OT4, it would leave Susan and Michael together angstily fucking away their issues over having been in an OT4 for a while?

\o/!

Did I ever snippet you any of that fic?

No! But it sounds awesome, and I would love to read it.

And the burgeoning feminist in me is wondering whether I've committed some irredeemable crime by making Talia's plan for averting the end of the universe to basically involve distracting everyone with sex, and she's sort of unclear about her reasons for doing so. I like my fic, but I worry I might be strung up by fandom. ;)

*shrug* I kind of figure anything with sex in it gets you a free pass from fandom. But then, I'm coming at this from the completely irredeemable position of fluffy het-writer, so my impressions may be skewed. I'm sure my Ivanova/Garibaldi series commits a thousand and one fandom sins.

(And, you know, Talia on the show is kind of a pawn always who gets violated a lot, so it's not entirely like I got this idea out of nowhere.)

Exactly! It would be completely in character, which IMO trumps all ideological opposition. ;)

You know, when you think about it, galactic wars aside, Sinclair probably served the station's original intention better. Although Sheridan had charisma to get people to unite, if a war didn't create itself for him, he might have made one out of boredom.

Sinclair truly did serve the station's purpose better, but yeah, gotta admit, Sheridan is a lot better for making people follow him into battle. I think possibly he generates some kind of charisma mind control.

Or by the idea that they will only encounter them in certain situations.

Oooh, that too.

I wonder whether telepaths go hang out in coffee shops and stuff like normal humans on Earth, or if they tend to keep to themselves?

Good question! Perhaps they have secret Psi Corps coffee shops? Maybe not. I bet they only go out for the bare minimum they can get away with (grocery stores, etc.), and then spend the rest of the time working, by themselves, or with other telepaths.