Fringe: "Neither Here Nor There"
Sep. 23rd, 2011 09:33 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
icepixieThat was...hmmm. I think I was expecting things to move faster, maybe, after last season, although I suppose at the same time it's helpful to slow down a bit and get used to the differences in a Peterless timeline. Still, it seemed to take a long time to get to the connection between the case of the week and the other universes--I figured they probably wouldn't introduce anything that wasn't directly related to that, since everyone was tasked with figuring out how to keep the red and blue universes from destroying themselves/each other, but since things were looking pretty stand alone up until the last ten minutes, I was starting to worry.
They did an excellent job with all the subtle differences in our Peterless universe. Olivia is much colder, like she was in the beginning of S1; Walter is heartbreakingly "untethered" and childlike; Astrid is basically the same, but she does get to do more (this timeline might actually be a net improvement for her). That said, I hope they don't drag out Peter's return for more than a couple weeks. I miss him and what he adds to the group.
I've actually never been a huge fan of either Lincoln, so I'm ambivalent about Seth Gabel's addition to the cast. I don't know that we really needed a new guy to help elucidate the differences in this timeline, and if he sticks around once Peter comes back (assuming he comes back in something resembling the role he filled before he got erased), we'll have the same over-crowding problem we had when our Charlie was still part of the team.
In general, though, I'm pleased. And the promo made this season look excellent.
Shorter thoughts:
Yay, Peter's flickering in and out of the universe! Poor, freaked-out Walter, though. I guess it's apropos that Walter's the one who can see him.
Orange credits! I would think purple would be more accurate...
And it's...John Sheppard. Who immediately dies. Huh. (But...then he comes back as a zombie shapeshifter? Was he the guy Lincoln shot at the end of the episode?)
Re-animated bird! Way cool, Walter. (I guess the corpses Olivia showed Lincoln must be coming back to life, then, to tie into this? I didn't really understand what was going on there.) What was the music playing over this scene? It sounded vaguely familiar, and also like an impressionist composer...Ravel? Debussy?
Walter invented bluetooth video because he's a shut-in! That's pretty cool. Not so cool for Astrid, though...
Things you should not admit in public, #389: "I need to erase someone from time." P.S. Meep.
"There's nothing sadder than when two people are meant to be together and something intervenes." Was that an anvil that just landed on my head? I was too busy cooing to notice.
Ooooh, yeah, the Olivia we know and love would definitely not have been okay with never telling the families of the victims that said victims were actually dead.
So...Charlie died in the pilot here? Is Astrid Olivia's partner now? (Well, prior to Lincoln.) 'Cause that would be awesome.
Did Walter actually call Astrid by her name?!
Would Peter's disappearance actually leave a hole in Olivia's life for as long as she can remember, though? Wouldn't it be just for the past three years? Maybe she wasn't talking about Peter there.
I was wondering earlier if all this was taking place in the purple/orange/whatever universe, but I guess that universe only exists in that one room...? Or maybe that's just a bridge of some kind, with no wider purple universe outside the room. Okay, I'm still kind of confused.
Walter bedding down in his office was the saddest thing ever.
Come on, Peter! Come back soon!
They did an excellent job with all the subtle differences in our Peterless universe. Olivia is much colder, like she was in the beginning of S1; Walter is heartbreakingly "untethered" and childlike; Astrid is basically the same, but she does get to do more (this timeline might actually be a net improvement for her). That said, I hope they don't drag out Peter's return for more than a couple weeks. I miss him and what he adds to the group.
I've actually never been a huge fan of either Lincoln, so I'm ambivalent about Seth Gabel's addition to the cast. I don't know that we really needed a new guy to help elucidate the differences in this timeline, and if he sticks around once Peter comes back (assuming he comes back in something resembling the role he filled before he got erased), we'll have the same over-crowding problem we had when our Charlie was still part of the team.
In general, though, I'm pleased. And the promo made this season look excellent.
Shorter thoughts:
Yay, Peter's flickering in and out of the universe! Poor, freaked-out Walter, though. I guess it's apropos that Walter's the one who can see him.
Orange credits! I would think purple would be more accurate...
And it's...John Sheppard. Who immediately dies. Huh. (But...then he comes back as a zombie shapeshifter? Was he the guy Lincoln shot at the end of the episode?)
Re-animated bird! Way cool, Walter. (I guess the corpses Olivia showed Lincoln must be coming back to life, then, to tie into this? I didn't really understand what was going on there.) What was the music playing over this scene? It sounded vaguely familiar, and also like an impressionist composer...Ravel? Debussy?
Walter invented bluetooth video because he's a shut-in! That's pretty cool. Not so cool for Astrid, though...
Things you should not admit in public, #389: "I need to erase someone from time." P.S. Meep.
"There's nothing sadder than when two people are meant to be together and something intervenes." Was that an anvil that just landed on my head? I was too busy cooing to notice.
Ooooh, yeah, the Olivia we know and love would definitely not have been okay with never telling the families of the victims that said victims were actually dead.
So...Charlie died in the pilot here? Is Astrid Olivia's partner now? (Well, prior to Lincoln.) 'Cause that would be awesome.
Did Walter actually call Astrid by her name?!
Would Peter's disappearance actually leave a hole in Olivia's life for as long as she can remember, though? Wouldn't it be just for the past three years? Maybe she wasn't talking about Peter there.
I was wondering earlier if all this was taking place in the purple/orange/whatever universe, but I guess that universe only exists in that one room...? Or maybe that's just a bridge of some kind, with no wider purple universe outside the room. Okay, I'm still kind of confused.
Walter bedding down in his office was the saddest thing ever.
Come on, Peter! Come back soon!
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no subject
Date: 2011-09-24 04:44 am (UTC)So, it looks like they're gonna drag this Peterless thing out for what, seven episodes or so? Like they did with getting Olivia out of the Red universe? This is one of those things that's gonna be much less frustrating in reruns, isn't it?
That being said, starting the season with a) a fight between Olivia and Fauxlivia, and b) nerd!Lincoln being nerdy and adorable was very promising. (Although I wonder if the Olivia/Fauxlivia dynamic has changed now that the love triangle never happened. Or maybe amber!Olivia is just naturally pissier?)
I was glad to get all the exposition about everything that un-happened in this timeline, but... where's the urgency? Is the Machine not blowing up anymore, since they never had Peter/Henry to put into it? Does nobody wonder how the bridge appeared? (And it does seem to be a bridge, which explains all the decontamination chamber stuff.)
(But...then he comes back as a zombie shapeshifter? Was he the guy Lincoln shot at the end of the episode?)
I'm confused about the see-through shapeshifters! I'm not sure who Lincoln shot, but that was definitely the dead engaged commuter victim looming ominously at the very end. Zombies indeed!
"I need to erase someone from time." P.S. Meep.
So... erasing September's rescue of Walter and Peter from the frozen lake wasn't effective enough (hence Walter's visions), so now he's trying to make Peter never be born at all? I'm assuming Walter still tried to steal Walternate's Peter after his died, right? He must have stolen him, to still have messed up the Red universe.
Was that an anvil that just landed on my head? I was too busy cooing to notice.
An anvil made of "awwwwwwwww"s!
Ooooh, yeah, the Olivia we know and love would definitely not have been okay with never telling the families of the victims that said victims were actually dead.
Especially when the alternative is... paperwork? Forged paperwork, but come on. And was Olivia so shy of saying "Fringe division" before? Did something happen?
So...Charlie died in the pilot here?
They still encountered the mercurial shapeshifters, so he still could've died two years prior to this.
Walter bedding down in his office was the saddest thing ever.
How did they even get him to this level of functionality without Peter??
WOES.
no subject
Date: 2011-09-24 04:58 am (UTC)Thirdhand info suggests more like 3-4 episodes. Also, things seemed to be coming to a head in the S4-in-general preview they showed in lieu of a preview for next week, and I think those kinds of things only have 4-5 episodes to draw from. I'm guessing he'll be back by episode five.
Although I wonder if the Olivia/Fauxlivia dynamic has changed now that the love triangle never happened. Or maybe amber!Olivia is just naturally pissier?
She seemed mostly ticked that Fauxlivia had kidnapped her. (Though why she did such a thing, since Peter no longer exists, remains to be seen.) And I think amber!Olivia is naturally pissier, yeah.
where's the urgency?
That was my problem with it as well. So much urgency in the finale, and then they hit the brakes. Weird. I mean, obviously things aren't as urgent for them as they were for us, since they never knew Peter, but...oof.
Is the Machine not blowing up anymore, since they never had Peter/Henry to put into it? Does nobody wonder how the bridge appeared?
Astrid mentioned that they were lucky the machine hadn't blown everyone up last time they used it. So I guess they used it, but without Peter or Henry...?
I'm confused about the see-through shapeshifters! I'm not sure who Lincoln shot, but that was definitely the dead engaged commuter victim looming ominously at the very end. Zombies indeed!
I did at least recognize her. Yeah, so far I'm not thrilled with this plot. Get some more recognizable actors, and maybe things would work better.
So... erasing September's rescue of Walter and Peter from the frozen lake wasn't effective enough (hence Walter's visions), so now he's trying to make Peter never be born at all?
I thought what Peter did last season made it so he was never born at all. Didn't the observers say that at the very end of the finale (I think the exact wording was that Peter never existed and none of the characters ever knew him)? I think what September was doing--or rather not doing--was trying to erase the flickers of Peter we were getting and Walter was seeing.
Of course, no we have no explanation for how Walter messed up the red universe. Maybe he (or Walternate, this time!) was just screwing around and messed things up inadvertently.
An anvil made of "awwwwwwwww"s!
So soft and cuddly!
And was Olivia so shy of saying "Fringe division" before? Did something happen?
I don't know that she ever really used it before--didn't she just identify herself as being from the FBI? The other FBI types she talked to already knew about Fringe Division.
They still encountered the mercurial shapeshifters, so he still could've died two years prior to this.
But would they have encountered them around the time of the pilot? Olivia said she lost her partner (I'm assuming Charlie) three years ago.
How did they even get him to this level of functionality without Peter??
Well, he never lost Peter in the first place. Maybe that makes a difference?
no subject
Date: 2011-09-24 05:27 am (UTC)the wha??
She seemed mostly ticked that Fauxlivia had kidnapped her. (Though why she did such a thing, since Peter no longer exists, remains to be seen.)
Riiiight. It'll be interesting to see how they make a new timeline that makes any sense without Peter in it, while still being anything like Bluniverse.
Astrid mentioned that they were lucky the machine hadn't blown everyone up last time they used it. So I guess they used it, but without Peter or Henry...?
But the Machine wouldn't even come on without Peter, so... huh? (And it's always bothered me: if Henry can turn on the Machine because he's 50% Peter's DNA, why can't Walter or Walternate, who are also 50% Peter's DNA? Arg!)
Get some more recognizable actors, and maybe things would work better.
Haha! Stupid white men, all looking alike!
Didn't the observers say that at the very end of the finale (I think the exact wording was that Peter never existed and none of the characters ever knew him)?
But... didn't the Observers say, in the restaurant, that they had to make sure nobody ever knew that Peter survived to grow up? And Walter said that some people die twice? Maybe it was just adult Peter that they made never happen?
So soft and cuddly!
Landing on our heads with a little "foomph!"
I don't know that she ever really used it before--didn't she just identify herself as being from the FBI?
She just seemed suuuper defensive of the whole idea with Lincoln, like it was a habit to hide it from everyone. And Bluniverse never had to hide bodies, either.
Olivia said she lost her partner (I'm assuming Charlie) three years ago.
That was John Scott!
Well, he never lost Peter in the first place. Maybe that makes a difference?
I got the impression that his Peter still died, though. And I don't think that level of crazy comes from just killing your lab assistant in a fire. (That poor girl just can't catch a break in any universe, can she?)
no subject
Date: 2011-09-25 03:10 am (UTC)Yeah, on the TV airing they never actually showed a preview for next week, just a "this season on Fringe" kinda dealie.
But the Machine wouldn't even come on without Peter, so... huh?
Maybe this version of the machine will? Perhaps it was calibrated for someone else in this universe.
(And it's always bothered me: if Henry can turn on the Machine because he's 50% Peter's DNA, why can't Walter or Walternate, who are also 50% Peter's DNA? Arg!)
Wasn't it that Henry could turn on the Machine, but not really do anything with it? Though yes, either Walter should be able to do the same.
But... didn't the Observers say, in the restaurant, that they had to make sure nobody ever knew that Peter survived to grow up? And Walter said that some people die twice? Maybe it was just adult Peter that they made never happen?
Wait, what? I totally missed that first bit, although I remember Walter saying that about some people dying twice. I assumed he was talking about some random person they'd seen die in both universes. In the finale, the Observers definitely say that Peter "never existed," which seems to indicate Walter/Walternate never had a son.
Landing on our heads with a little "foomph!"
Making us see little cartoon tweety birds!
That was John Scott!
!!! I had totally forgotten he ever existed!
I got the impression that his Peter still died, though.
I am still very confused.
And I don't think that level of crazy comes from just killing your lab assistant in a fire.
I wonder if, without Peter there to talk to her as a kid, Olivia never went to him about her abusive father and he never got a chance to develop the tiny bit of compassion that seemed to spark in him, leading to further immorality and an even greater breakdown later on? I don't remember that "meeting AS KIDS!" episode very well, so I may be totally wrong here.
no subject
Date: 2011-09-27 01:53 am (UTC)Ugh, can't find it! Did, however, find this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH5eC2Cko4I). I hate you, Fox!
Perhaps it was calibrated for someone else in this universe.
Hmmm.... see, so many of these Peterless-scenarios involve great big swerves away from canon into unrecognizability!
Wasn't it that Henry could turn on the Machine, but not really do anything with it?
Well, his blood turned on the Machine, apparently. At least someone didn't believe in child experimentation. Although that could change...
In the finale, the Observers definitely say that Peter "never existed," which seems to indicate Walter/Walternate never had a son.
But that could still refer to "the Peter who lived 25 years after falling in the lake"! Stupid Observers and your vagueness! Why don't you print us out a handy fact sheet for once??
Making us see little cartoon tweety birds!
And twirly hearts!
!!! I had totally forgotten he ever existed!
The show has made that easy to do! Not that I'm complaining!
I wonder if, without Peter there to talk to her as a kid, Olivia never went to him about her abusive father and he never got a chance to develop the tiny bit of compassion that seemed to spark in him, leading to further immorality and an even greater breakdown later on?
That's... plausible? Yeah, I never quite followed the logic of that episode, and didn't feel compelled to really sit down and sort it out, either.
no subject
Date: 2011-09-27 04:07 am (UTC)Did, however, find this. I hate you, Fox!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Okay, that was hilarious.
so many of these Peterless-scenarios involve great big swerves away from canon into unrecognizability!
Well, he was a pretty big part of canon...
Stupid Observers and your vagueness! Why don't you print us out a handy fact sheet for once??
I'm sure the two Olivias could scare them into giving out some facts...
That's... plausible?
Perhaps more so than that episode ever thought about being?
no subject
Date: 2011-09-27 04:38 am (UTC)Oho! Sneaky Fox, sneaking that onto YouTube when I wasn't looking!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Okay, that was hilarious.
Bastards!
Well, he was a pretty big part of canon...
As fascinating as this It's A Wonderful Life premise is, pulling it off well is gonna be tricky. Then again, Abrams & Co don't really aim low...
I'm sure the two Olivias could scare them into giving out some facts...
OH MY GOD I CAN'T WAIT FOR THEM TO GANG UP ON SOMEBODY. IT'S GONNA BE EPIC.
Perhaps more so than that episode ever thought about being?
Lalalalala it's noncanon I can't see it!