Question

[icepixie]

Hmmm. I appear to be writing fanfic for my fake TV show. I'd say I'm writing actual canon for it, because it's mine and technically anything I write for it is canon, right? but...it reads like fic. It really does. This is not a short story, with its associated rising and falling action, etc., in any way, shape, or form. It does not introduce the characters in any meaningful way. It's totally four little filler fics stuck together because they share a theme. (Not to mention that some of the voices are ripped straight out of fanfic. And by "some" I pretty much mean "all.")

That said: in this universe, by 2231 Vancouver has a major league baseball team. (WHY do I keep writing characters who like team sports when I hate them, why why why?) I need a name for this team. I get the impression that baseball team names usually have some connection to their city, and sports team names in general often make reference to sharp pointy objects, such as an animal with sharp teeth, a person whose job it was to fight with swords or spears, &tc. Granted, baseball naming appears less bloodthirsty than other sports.

Anyway, the only two names I can come up with are Pioneers and (Killer) Whales. The first one has promise; the second, not so much. Suggestions? If it helps, this team is not very good; they aren't as unlucky as the Cubs (who, sorry to say, are still the watchword for "lost hope" even two centuries on), but they aren't in danger of stumbling into a World Series anytime soon, so something that sounds hapless might be good.

Also, a related question: let's say that someone is commenting on a team's haplessness, and doing so by saying, "They haven't won a title/pennant/championship/? in twenty years!" I don't really know how baseball playoffs are structured, but I want to emphasize that this team has not been doing well, so what level would they not exceed if they sucked just enough for non-fans to make fun of them, but for fans to keep cheering them on?

Comments

[graycardinal]

"Killer Whales" is indeed a little unwieldy; OTOH, "Orcas" (another word for "killer whale") would work well. Also: Islanders, Ravens, Thunderbirds.

And "pennant" (aka "league championship") is probably good for competitive reference.

[icepixie]

I like the idea of "Orcas," but when I say "Vancouver Orcas" together it all sort of mashes into one word, with the R and the O being right next to each other. Islanders is a possibility. Someone over on the LJ post also mentioned Sockeyes, which I like a lot.

I think I'm going to have the dialogue go, "They haven't come near the pennant in twenty years." Thanks!

[aris_tgd]

Vancouver BC, or WA? ;)

[icepixie]

Touche. ;)

[kurayaminokoe.livejournal.com]

My softball/baseball team is called Quick, but generally, yeah, there's a city/place name and something that sounds good? I've also seen teams that obviously get sponsored and use the company's name in their name. I also know there's a team called Survivors.

We play like...5th division, which is like, the suckiest and lowest division *snort*. Not sure how play offs go anyhow, cause I'm not in the states, and really, you don't expect me to play play-offs lol.

I need to read the post you linked to but my dinner really needs preparing.

[icepixie]

"Quick" could be kind of fun to make jokes out of. Though I like the suggestion of "Sockeyes" below; there's a connection to the city, and for purely aesthetic purposes, I tend to prefer plural rather than singular nouns for team names.

Eat your dinner! :)

[idharao.livejournal.com]

Hey there!

I added you because of your fabulous Fred and Ginger stuff, hope you don't mind. :)

As for a team that sucks but people still love, The NY Mets are the major team where I live in Queens NY. I'm personally a Yankees fan, but there are RABID Mets fans who just can't let it go, no matter how bad the team does. It's a combination of nostalgia and Queens pride and anti-Yankees sentiment. So... the Mets aren't great but people are just nuts about them. Look up some stuff about them; once you get past the crazy "THE YANKEES ARE THE DEVILLLLL!" stuff, it's really some nice and proud stuff.

A team that sucks wouldn't make it to the playoffs, which is where they play for the pennant (which means they're the best in the league-- in the US there's the American and the National leagues and one team from each plays in the Series) that would qualify them for the World Series. A sucky team would win games on and off but never quite get to the championship games. Hope that helps!

[icepixie]

Hello! :)

I actually almost made the Cubs fan in this scenario a Mets fan, but then I decided I wanted to have the character be from Chicago. (The actor I chose to play him in the fake TV show meme this comes from played a guy generally assumed to be from NYC on the show he's known for, so I wanted to get away from that.)

From your comment, and another person's, it seems like "They haven't come near a pennant in twenty years" would be a good way for one of the characters to comment on the suckiness of the other team.

[idharao.livejournal.com]

Yes ma'am that would be a good way to describe it. Even the Mets have a World Series or two, but, for example, the Washington Senators, do not.

Fake TV show, ahaha! I really like that. What's it about? We should chat about writing, etc. I like everything of yours that I've read, and I'm sure we could natter on about Fred and Ginger for a quite a bit.

[icepixie]

The fake TV show is this. mylittleredgirl gave me a list of actors and actresses with which to cast a show, and I wrote up a show concept and descriptions of the characters. I don't think I'll really do much with it, but someday I might try to make a novel out of it. If you want to make one of your own, leave a comment and I'll be happy to give you a cast list.

I'm glad you liked the Fred and Ginger stuff! Thank you. :) I've kind of moved on from them of late, but I tend to return to former fandoms at random intervals. I've got bits of a Swing Time/The Thin Man crossover that I'd like to finish one day, if I can ever figure out what to do with it.

[idharao.livejournal.com]

The TV show is awesome! The detail you put into it is really very cool. The novel idea is a good one; when I think of movies and screenplays I tend to novelize them. And I loves me some Chi McBride.

It's a shame you've moved on from F&G, since you're one of the only other people I've encountered who really likes their work. I have theories and fics (unfinished, natch) that, should you ever return to that fandom, would certainly bear a look-see.

[icepixie]

Thank you! I had a lot of fun with it.

Now you've made me curious. What are these "theories" you speak of? Do tell! BTW, have you run into eldivinomarques and postgirl66? They're both big Fred and Ginger fans, and very knowledgeable/passionate about the movies. And Fred in general, really.

[idharao.livejournal.com]

I have seen them post here, but I don't know them, but... Hello, fellow Fred fanatics! [|:) <-- it's a man in a top hat!


These theories, I say... they would need a message, I think, to avoid a HUGE wall of text, but I'll put down the thesis of what I've been speculating about.

I write Fred and Ginger as two people in love, because that's what they are. As a performer I have done a lot of hard work with a few people and grown very close to them. When one does something as intimate as dancing, with the same person, for a long time, it's absolutely inevitable that a strong bond forms. I simply don't see how there was not some kind of involvement between them. I don't mean a sordid, torrid affair; I mean a real relationship of trust and love and acceptance. Such high art could not exist without real love. Further pondering on the possibly sexual nature of their relationship can be expanded on.

When I write any sort of F&G fandom fic, I write Fred's character as unabashedly in love, an emotion which I think men don't show anymore. Ginger is always her own woman, but smart enough and aware enough to understand that Fred is her other half.

Shall I elaborate further?

[|:) fred 8(:-}) ginger

[icepixie]

I thought it was pretty much accepted that they had had some kind of relationship, probably sexual, in New York before they became Hollywood stars. Ginger talks about their dates in her autobiography, and third-person sources with access to letters, etc., seem to come down on the side of something happening at some point. I agree that it's unlikely they were at each others' throats while filming the movies, as the popular press of the time would have it (they both say they liked each other as co-workers in their autobiographies, though I'm sure they were edited to make everyone look good). Beyond that...I guess I tend to be more drawn to the characters they played than Fred and Ginger themselves, so I haven't really given it much thought! :)

I like your interpretation of their characters, and tend to write them that way myself. His character is always the more...enthusiastic, maybe? of the two, and definitely knows his own heart before she knows hers. Well, minus Carefree, anyway. Heh.

Feel free to message me if you like! My computer's in the shop at the moment, so it may take me a while to get back to you, just FYI.

[idharao.livejournal.com]

I am in the process of writing your message, my dear! Hope you get your computer back soon.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I know little to nothing about sports teams, but back in the late 90s, Seattle had a women's basketball team called the Reign. I always loved the implied pun, and it would work equally well for Vancouver...

Edited to add: while I'm providing local anecdotes that might be useful in naming sport teams, maybe Orca would work better than Killer Whale? Other local options for animals that would be good to name a team after are Sockeyes (a kind of salmon - that one might be great, as it's also aurally reminiscent of team names like the White Sox?), Sturgeons, Ospreys, etc?

[icepixie]

Oh, man. I am so tempted by that fabulous Reign/Rain pun. You have no idea. :D

But on a purely aesthetic level, singular nouns for team names kind of bother me. And I really like Sockeyes for the reason you mentioned. It also flows well with "Vancouver," which "Vancouver Orcas" doesn't, so much...the R and the O kind of merge together. I think I'm going with Sockeyes. Thanks! :)

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I never saw a game, but I was pissed when we lost them and got the WNBA Seattle Storm instead. Come on, Storm? After an awesome name like the Reign?!

But yeah, Vancouver Sockeyes just kind of sounds right, I agree. And... yeah, I suspect there may be a very good reason there are no teams (of anything that I know of) named for orcas. It just... sounds strange.

[icepixie]

I kind of like Storm, actually, but I agree that Reign is better.

(Some university names/mascots, though, they take the cake. Isn't there one in California that's a banana slug? And my grad school was the Volunteers, which is lame, lame, lame. The construction cone orange the school uses for a color is also horrible. On the other hand, the mascot is a coonhound, and dogs are an automatic +10 points, IMO.)

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

The Storm is a good name, but... I don't know. I miss the fabulous wordplay of the Reign, that's all.

(The Volunteers? Good lord. My high school was the Patriots (our school was founded the year of the bicentennial...), and I thought that was pretty lame. College was the Huskies, though, and I agree entirely about dogs getting automatic awesome points. ;)

[icepixie]

The Volunteers thing comes from Tennessee sending the most soldiers of any state to fight in the War of 1812, or something like that. Still a dumb name. The dog is cute, though.

If only the team name had been, like, Dukes/Duchesses or Kings/Queens, I would've continued my ascent up the chain of nobility; my high school team was the Knights and college was Lords/Ladies. Which is about as hard to make a mascot out of as Volunteer, but is still somehow better.

[mylittleredgirl.livejournal.com]

Wheeee! Baseball and fic! :)

On the first note - I have written future-AU-anti-OTP fic for one of my fake shows. IDEK.

Baseball! <3 I kind of love that baseball is still being played on a major league scale by 2231. That is crazy and awesome.

It's kind of hard to foresee what the demographics or culture of a city might be like in 200 years, but before I noticed the date I was thinking of the "Dragons" possibly, as those have pointy teeth and would be a nod to the high Chinese population in the city and the related cultural influence - Chinatown is a big deal there. Their hockey team is the Canucks, so you could just steal that name or go with something equally Canadian. Their soccer team is the Whitecaps, which I find dorky and hapless, also. Personally, I think they should be the Inukshuk (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inukshuk), though! :) It was the symbol for the Vancouver Olympics aside from generally being awesome. At the very least, Inukshuk Field for their park, right?

The Cubs are famously cursed to never win the Pennant, which is the step right before the World Series. It a team hasn't made the playoffs in 20 years, they will definitely be written off by other teams, so that's probably a good way to go!

[icepixie]

Wheeee! Baseball and fic! :)

Why do I keep doing this to myself? I desperately need to make one of my characters a dancer or something. (Heh, actually, the alien team sport two of my characters are about to participate in is kind of like dancing.)

"Dragons" could be really cool; I was thinking it might be good to nod to the huge Chinese population. Plus they have pointy teeth. :D But I'm also really digging rivendellrose's suggestion of the Vancouver Sockeyes, particularly since I'm thinking that there will have been a big environmental movement sometime in the past two hundred years, perhaps around the time the team was formed, and that might've had an impact on the naming? IDK. I also kind of like the sound of "Sockeye." Sounds...punchy. ;)

Definitely Inukshuk Field for the park!

It a team hasn't made the playoffs in 20 years, they will definitely be written off by other teams, so that's probably a good way to go!

\o/!

[amaresu]

The Vancouver hockey team is called the Canucks and they have a killer whale as a mascot?

As for the suck-not suck thing it could be a bit like Minnesota sports. The teams are just good enough that you continually hold out hope that they'll win something and then they fail. They fail utterly. They could win everything they needed to win over the course of the season and then at the big game it's like the forget how to play. And yet, we still hold out hope that one day they'll give us the payoff. Because sometimes they do, but only once every few decades. So you end up with rather devote sports fans that are all the same not that surprised when they don't win the big trophy.

[icepixie]

Hehe, yes, my fake Vancouver team is going to be much like the Minnesota teams; currently one character is teasing another about how they haven't gotten to the World Series in twelve years, and the last time they did, they lost every game. But this character's Cubs have been doing even worse for the past few decades.